From erik at xs4all.net Thu Feb 3 01:57:00 2005 From: erik at xs4all.net (Erik Bos) Date: Thu Feb 3 01:57:43 2005 Subject: [6bone] XS4ALL/AS3265: returning 6bone ipv6 address space Message-ID: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> hi guys, XS4ALL/AS3265 has renumbered its infrastructure and customers to RIR space last year and is returning its 6bone assignment 3ffe:8280::/28. I've deleted our entries in the 6bone registry. So long and thanks for all the fish. Erik Bos XS4ALL From hank at mail.iucc.ac.il Tue Feb 8 01:06:36 2005 From: hank at mail.iucc.ac.il (Hank Nussbacher) Date: Tue Feb 8 01:10:02 2005 Subject: [6bone] [Article] MCI takes step toward commercial IPv6 service In-Reply-To: <004101c2aa1c$5ee6b7a0$210d640a@unfix.org> References: Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050208110552.00ab5da8@mail.iucc.ac.il> http://www.nwfusion.com/news/2005/020705-moonv6.html -Hank From jeroen at unfix.org Fri Feb 11 13:35:03 2005 From: jeroen at unfix.org (Jeroen Massar) Date: Fri Feb 11 13:36:48 2005 Subject: [6bone] XS4ALL/AS3265: returning 6bone ipv6 address space Message-ID: <1108157703.30765.7.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> Erik Bos wrote at the 3rd of February: > hi guys, > > XS4ALL/AS3265 has renumbered its infrastructure and customers to RIR space > last year and is returning its 6bone assignment 3ffe:8280::/28. I've deleted > our entries in the 6bone registry. Looking at: http://mailman.isi.edu/pipermail/6bone/2005-February/thread.html and at: http://www.6bone.net/6bone_pTLA_list.html This pTLA has not been officially registered as 'returned', can somebody take a look at it ? Also the PTLA list above should also mention that 2003::/16 is now part of RIR space... Greets, Jeroen -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 240 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://mailman.isi.edu/pipermail/6bone/attachments/20050211/562b1a7c/attachment.bin From bobfink at gmail.com Fri Feb 11 14:24:50 2005 From: bobfink at gmail.com (Robert Fink) Date: Fri Feb 11 14:27:35 2005 Subject: [6bone] XS4ALL/AS3265: returning 6bone ipv6 address space In-Reply-To: <1108157703.30765.7.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> References: <1108157703.30765.7.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> Message-ID: <2a8350a6050211142446cfc772@mail.gmail.com> Jeroen, I'll fix it. If you note other pTLAs that have been returned, please let me know so I can fix those too. Thanks, Bob On Fri, 11 Feb 2005 22:35:03 +0100, Jeroen Massar wrote: > Erik Bos wrote at the 3rd of February: > > hi guys, > > > > XS4ALL/AS3265 has renumbered its infrastructure and customers to RIR space > > last year and is returning its 6bone assignment 3ffe:8280::/28. I've deleted > > our entries in the 6bone registry. > > Looking at: > http://mailman.isi.edu/pipermail/6bone/2005-February/thread.html > > and at: > http://www.6bone.net/6bone_pTLA_list.html > > This pTLA has not been officially registered as 'returned', can somebody take a look at it ? > Also the PTLA list above should also mention that 2003::/16 is now part of RIR space... > > Greets, > Jeroen > > > _______________________________________________ > 6bone mailing list > 6bone@mailman.isi.edu > http://mailman.isi.edu/mailman/listinfo/6bone > > > > From jeroen at unfix.org Sat Feb 12 08:23:48 2005 From: jeroen at unfix.org (Jeroen Massar) Date: Sat Feb 12 08:24:23 2005 Subject: Cleaning up unused 6bone spaces (Was: Re: [6bone] XS4ALL/AS3265: returning 6bone ipv6 address space) In-Reply-To: <2a8350a6050211142446cfc772@mail.gmail.com> References: <1108157703.30765.7.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> <2a8350a6050211142446cfc772@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1108225428.30765.41.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> On Fri, 2005-02-11 at 14:24 -0800, Robert Fink wrote: > Jeroen, > > I'll fix it. > > If you note other pTLAs that have been returned, please let me know so > I can fix those too. None afaik officially, that is as announced on the 6bone mailinglist. But there are quite a number of prefixes which have not been announced for quite some time already as per: http://www.sixxs.net/tools/grh/tla/6bone/ Gone before 2004-01-01: 3ffe:0e00::/24 IFB/GB 2003-06-13 10:55:25 3ffe:0f00::/24 DEFENSENET/US 2003-09-26 22:21:06 3ffe:2300::/24 INFN-CNAF/IT 2003-06-13 10:55:24 3ffe:3000::/32 AMS-IX/NL 2003-06-13 10:55:25 3ffe:400e::/32 ECITY/IT 2003-06-09 11:14:30 3ffe:8120::/28 CERN/CH 2003-09-26 22:21:06 3ffe:8190::/28 ISDNET/FR 2003-10-28 22:50:47 3ffe:8260::/28 COMPENDIUM-AR/AR 2003-06-09 11:14:30 3ffe:8290::/28 AOL/US 2003-06-09 12:03:47 Gone before 2005-01-01: 3ffe:1100::/24 UUNET-UK/GB 2004-08-04 15:17:37 3ffe:1b00::/24 UL/PT 2004-02-03 14:20:36 3ffe:1c00::/24 MERIT/US-MI 2004-04-21 11:21:02 3ffe:2400::/32 INS/RU 2004-01-28 04:50:54 3ffe:4006::/32 DOLPHINS-CH/CH 2004-09-27 08:32:15 3ffe:4009::/32 VERAT/YU 2004-08-19 13:17:16 3ffe:400c::/32 ICPNET-PL/PL 2004-12-05 15:17:18 3ffe:8030::/28 GTPV6/EU 2004-01-14 11:40:43 3ffe:8100::/28 EURONET-BE 2004-08-04 15:17:37 3ffe:8150::/28 SOLNET-CH 2004-10-22 11:47:16 3ffe:81e0::/28 IPv6-BITS-IN/IN 2004-04-17 00:50:35 3ffe:8210::/28 ATMAN6/PL 2004-11-05 12:02:17 Gone in the last 2 months: 3ffe:400b::/32 INET-TH/TH 2005-02-11 15:17:18 3ffe:4012::/32 EUROVIEW/ES 2005-02-09 14:32:58 3ffe:401a::/32 RETINA/AR 2005-01-11 17:17:18 Someone might want to contact these people if they want to return their allocation or simply to query them if there is anyone even still aware that they actually have such a prefix. Some of the above ISP's have migrated to RIR space, but simply haven't bothered officially yelling "hey we had fun and we are done, we are returning the space". 3ffe:3800::/24 (FIBERTEL) & 3ffe:1300::/24 (NORTEL) are both being announced by FIBERTEL (10318) but I have never been able to contact them about fixing them announcing 3ffe:1300::/24. One thing to note though is that the inet6num for 3ffe:1300::/24 is gone from the 6bone database, while the ipv6-site is still there... Greets, Jeroen BTW: Of course, even though a prefix is not globally announced people could still be using it, in which case they are most likely reading this list and can easily comment here that they are still using it. Wasn't there a clause in the pTLA thing that you needed valid contacts and that one must be subscribed to this list ? :) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 240 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://mailman.isi.edu/pipermail/6bone/attachments/20050212/7e0a33d2/attachment.bin From jeroen at unfix.org Mon Feb 14 01:35:23 2005 From: jeroen at unfix.org (Jeroen Massar) Date: Mon Feb 14 01:36:26 2005 Subject: [6bone] Re: Cleaning up unused 6bone spaces In-Reply-To: <20050214090631.GM27425@droll.dtm.ops.eu.uu.net> References: <1108157703.30765.7.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> <2a8350a6050211142446cfc772@mail.gmail.com> <1108225428.30765.41.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> <20050214090631.GM27425@droll.dtm.ops.eu.uu.net> Message-ID: <1108373723.25546.55.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> [Sprint & ATNET, please read the last paragraph, after the =-= and act upon...] On Mon, 2005-02-14 at 09:06 +0000, Gerrit Wenig wrote: > Hi Jeroen, > > On Sat, 12 Feb 2005, Jeroen Massar wrote: > > > Gone before 2005-01-01: > > 3ffe:1100::/24 UUNET-UK/GB 2004-08-04 15:17:37 > > This one we have given back end of July 2004. > I had not sent it to the 6Bone list, but I had > contacted Bob. It's also documented as returned on > http://www.6bone.net/6bone_pTLA_list.html I've updated that in the GRH list, thanks for the notify. After that I verified that it matched the rest of the list and found the following few obscurities: The following is odd btw: INFN-CNAF/IT 3FFE:2300::/24 review of current inactivity underway [17Jan03] IFB/GB 3FFE:0E00::/24 review of current inactivity underway [17Jan03] Not seen in the GRT since 2003-06-13, almost two years ago, thus I guess that these can be reclaimed. The most likely reason why both have the same date is because some ISP started announcing all the prefixes known to mankind at that time. =-= The following is quite funny now of course: RECLAIMED 3FFE:1300::/24 RECLAIMED from BAY/US-MA [04Sep03] As it is *still* being announced by Fibertel, to whom no contact can be made. They are also quite apparently not reading this mailinglist. I've CC'd both Sprint (AS6175) and ATNET (AS5424) as they seem to be playing transit for AS10318* Paths like these (Greece, Sprint, South America, Austria) don't seem to make much sense anyway: 3ffe:2d00::/24 2001:4f8:1::7 3557 6939 6939 5424 10318 6175 5408 Or ATNET's 6bone prefix: 3ffe:8060::/28 2001:838:0:ffff::1 12871 24587 6453 10566 6175 10318 5424 That is Austria -> South America -> Sprint -> Canada -> Netherlands And folks, please read: http://ip6.de.easynet.net/ipv6-minimum-peering.txt That avoids funny paths like the above. And there is *enough* connectivity in Europe for ATNET if they need it, just ask. Greets, Jeroen * = http://www.sixxs.net/tools/grh/lg/?find=3ffe:1300::/24 http://www.sixxs.net/tools/grh/lg/? findtype=aspath_contains&find=10318 abuse@atnet.at added because that is what http://www.sixxs.net/tools/whois/?3ffe:8060::/28 mentions to do for complaints and this is a complaint about them announcing a reclaimed prefix and playing transit for a bogus ASN including fulltable swapping. And I am putting it nicely, it is Valentine's day afterall ;) -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 240 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://mailman.isi.edu/pipermail/6bone/attachments/20050214/be5fea71/attachment.bin From M.Wozniak at zehs.com.pl Tue Feb 15 23:04:01 2005 From: M.Wozniak at zehs.com.pl (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?Mariusz_Wo=BCniak?=) Date: Tue Feb 15 23:05:23 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> Message-ID: <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> Hi, I need advice. I have working revDNS zone for my subnet (.ip6.arpa), but i still need ip6.int. Is there any record "like CNAME" which can i put in arpa zone file for ip6.int records ? Or i just have to make 2nd zone file with int records ? From jeroen at unfix.org Wed Feb 16 01:20:51 2005 From: jeroen at unfix.org (Jeroen Massar) Date: Wed Feb 16 01:23:23 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> Message-ID: <1108545651.5572.3.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> On Wed, 2005-02-16 at 08:04 +0100, Mariusz Wo?niak wrote: >Hi, > >I need advice. I have working revDNS zone for my subnet (.ip6.arpa), but >i still need ip6.int. For what do you need ip6.int? By now (ip6.int was deprecated 4 years ago!) you should have switched everything to ip6.arpa already. >Is there any record "like CNAME" which can i put >in arpa zone file for ip6.int records ? Or i just have to make 2nd zone >file with int records ? What you can do is a DNAME: ip6.int DNAME ip6.arpa. Put that in any of your DNS servers which you use for resolving as authoritative and you are done. eg: 8<------------------ $ dig @ns1.sixxs.net remove.ip6.int ;; ANSWER SECTION: ip6.int. 604800 IN DNAME ip6.arpa. remove.ip6.int. 0 IN CNAME remove.ip6.arpa. ------------------>8 Greets, Jeroen -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 240 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://mailman.isi.edu/pipermail/6bone/attachments/20050216/f4fe0244/attachment.bin From dlc-6bone at halibut.com Wed Feb 16 02:30:32 2005 From: dlc-6bone at halibut.com (David Carmean) Date: Wed Feb 16 02:31:23 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl>; from M.Wozniak@zehs.com.pl on Wed, Feb 16, 2005 at 08:04:01AM +0100 References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> Message-ID: <20050216023032.L23688@halibut.com> You want the DNAME record: http://www.isc.org/pubs/tn/isc-tn-2002-1.html On Wed, Feb 16, 2005 at 08:04:01AM +0100, Mariusz Wozniak wrote: > Hi, > > I need advice. I have working revDNS zone for my subnet (.ip6.arpa), but > i still need ip6.int. Is there any record "like CNAME" which can i put > in arpa zone file for ip6.int records ? Or i just have to make 2nd zone > file with int records ? > > _______________________________________________ > 6bone mailing list > 6bone@mailman.isi.edu > http://mailman.isi.edu/mailman/listinfo/6bone From M.Wozniak at zehs.com.pl Wed Feb 16 03:28:01 2005 From: M.Wozniak at zehs.com.pl (=?UTF-8?B?TWFyaXVzeiBXb8W6bmlhaw==?=) Date: Wed Feb 16 03:28:22 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <1108545651.5572.3.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <1108545651.5572.3.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> Message-ID: <42132E41.1040405@zehs.com.pl> Jeroen wrote: >For what do you need ip6.int? >By now (ip6.int was deprecated 4 years ago!) you should have switched >everything to ip6.arpa already. > > Some services still resolve int records. I was in "sleeping mode" with ipv6 projects, but im back, i want to be "on time" when all start working :) I have new IP and some time to work. I want to change/add ipv6's to my webserver, ssh, ircserver, 2 lan networks (every comp with private ipv6), some route practice, and rest of things that i make using ipv4. I want to check how far can i go with new architecture. >What you can do is a DNAME: > >ip6.int DNAME ip6.arpa. > >Put that in any of your DNS servers which you use for resolving as >authoritative and you are done. > >eg: > >8<------------------ >$ dig @ns1.sixxs.net remove.ip6.int > >;; ANSWER SECTION: >ip6.int. 604800 IN DNAME ip6.arpa. >remove.ip6.int. 0 IN CNAME remove.ip6.arpa. >------------------>8 > > Thx. I will work now with DNAME. But for now (12:27 CET) i leave old int like it is, and just add arpa records. Some clean/remove int in future, is in my plan :) From tvo at enterzone.net Wed Feb 16 09:49:52 2005 From: tvo at enterzone.net (John Fraizer) Date: Wed Feb 16 09:50:56 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> Message-ID: <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> Mariusz Wo?niak wrote: > Hi, > > I need advice. I have working revDNS zone for my subnet (.ip6.arpa), but > i still need ip6.int. Is there any record "like CNAME" which can i put > in arpa zone file for ip6.int records ? Or i just have to make 2nd zone > file with int records ? > #!/bin/bash sed 's/ip6.arpa/ip6.int/g' source.ip6.arpa > destination.ip6.int Make your edits to the arpa zone, then, simply run the script above to generate your ip6.int zone. John From old_mc_donald at hotmail.com Thu Feb 17 03:31:23 2005 From: old_mc_donald at hotmail.com (Gav) Date: Thu Feb 17 03:32:28 2005 Subject: [6bone] Solaris Message-ID: Are Sun now getting their act together.? To those in the know, after looking at http://www.sun.com/software/solaris/ds/network_performance.jsp does Solaris 10 now beat the likes of MS and *BSD.? I'm downloading it now anyway to give it a test run. It would be nice to have one or two IPv6 only apps to try out on it. Anyone use Solaris? Gav... From iljitsch at muada.com Thu Feb 17 11:41:39 2005 From: iljitsch at muada.com (Iljitsch van Beijnum) Date: Thu Feb 17 11:58:34 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> Message-ID: <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> On 16-feb-05, at 18:49, John Fraizer wrote: >> I have working revDNS zone for my subnet (.ip6.arpa), but i still >> need ip6.int. > #!/bin/bash > sed 's/ip6.arpa/ip6.int/g' source.ip6.arpa > destination.ip6.int Ok, so what happens now is that d.e.a.d.b.e.e.f.ip6.arpa and d.e.a.d.b.e.e.f.ip6.int are equivalent. However, this doesn't seem to be in line with the RFCs I'm reading. In the beginning, there was RFC 1886, and we had the x.x.x.x.ip6.int reverse mapping and life was good. Then at some point a whole bunch of RFCs was published with a whole new way of doing things, in the RFC 2[8|6]7x range. However, those RFCs DO NOT mandate the use of x.x.x.x.ip6.arpa, as far as I can tell from a quick scan. According to those RFCs, looking up the reverse mapping should be done the way the host and nslookup commands on my Mac do: [alumange:~] iljitsch% host 2001:200::8002:203:47ff:fea5:3085 Host \[x2001020000008002020347FFFEA53085/128].ip6.arpa not found: 3(NXDOMAIN) [alumange:~] iljitsch% nslookup -silent 2001:200::8002:203:47ff:fea5:3085 sequoia Server: sequoia Address: 2001:1af8:2:5::2#53 ** server can't find \[x2001020000008002020347FFFEA53085/128].ip6.arpa: NXDOMAIN Now RFC 3364 says the RFC 2874 is better, but the additional benefit over the RFC 1886 way is too small to warrant the trouble of the gruesome upgrade cycle that's needed. So how did we end up in the current x.x.x.x.ip6.arpa situation? I haven't been able to find any document that mandates this, what gives? From tboss at research.earthlink.net Thu Feb 17 13:03:59 2005 From: tboss at research.earthlink.net (Tim Bosserman) Date: Thu Feb 17 13:04:46 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> Message-ID: I believe the RFC you are looking for is 3596: DNS Extensions to Support IP Version 6. It officially obsoletes 1886 and 3152. -- Tim Bosserman EarthLink R&D On Thu, 17 Feb 2005, Iljitsch van Beijnum wrote: > On 16-feb-05, at 18:49, John Fraizer wrote: > >>> I have working revDNS zone for my subnet (.ip6.arpa), but i still need >>> ip6.int. > >> #!/bin/bash >> sed 's/ip6.arpa/ip6.int/g' source.ip6.arpa > destination.ip6.int > > Ok, so what happens now is that d.e.a.d.b.e.e.f.ip6.arpa and > d.e.a.d.b.e.e.f.ip6.int are equivalent. However, this doesn't seem to be in > line with the RFCs I'm reading. > > In the beginning, there was RFC 1886, and we had the x.x.x.x.ip6.int reverse > mapping and life was good. > > Then at some point a whole bunch of RFCs was published with a whole new way > of doing things, in the RFC 2[8|6]7x range. However, those RFCs DO NOT > mandate the use of x.x.x.x.ip6.arpa, as far as I can tell from a quick scan. > > According to those RFCs, looking up the reverse mapping should be done the > way the host and nslookup commands on my Mac do: > > [alumange:~] iljitsch% host 2001:200::8002:203:47ff:fea5:3085 > Host \[x2001020000008002020347FFFEA53085/128].ip6.arpa not found: 3(NXDOMAIN) > [alumange:~] iljitsch% nslookup -silent 2001:200::8002:203:47ff:fea5:3085 > sequoia > Server: sequoia > Address: 2001:1af8:2:5::2#53 > > ** server can't find \[x2001020000008002020347FFFEA53085/128].ip6.arpa: > NXDOMAIN > > Now RFC 3364 says the RFC 2874 is better, but the additional benefit over the > RFC 1886 way is too small to warrant the trouble of the gruesome upgrade > cycle that's needed. > > So how did we end up in the current x.x.x.x.ip6.arpa situation? I haven't > been able to find any document that mandates this, what gives? > > _______________________________________________ > 6bone mailing list > 6bone@mailman.isi.edu > http://mailman.isi.edu/mailman/listinfo/6bone > From dragon at tdoi.org Thu Feb 17 13:07:46 2005 From: dragon at tdoi.org (Christian Nickel) Date: Thu Feb 17 13:08:35 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> Message-ID: <200502172107.j1HL7S102932@matrix.tdoi.org> ... > So how did we end up in the current x.x.x.x.ip6.arpa situation? I haven't been able to find any document that mandates this, what gives? just read RFC3363 and you get all the answers you need :-) current standard is ip6.arpa in nibble format bitstring format is now experimental ip6.int is dead :-) From iljitsch at muada.com Thu Feb 17 13:38:59 2005 From: iljitsch at muada.com (Iljitsch van Beijnum) Date: Thu Feb 17 13:40:10 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <200502172107.j1HL7S102932@matrix.tdoi.org> References: <200502172107.j1HL7S102932@matrix.tdoi.org> Message-ID: <06b90c283bd1fd17b3a50f84b71e9486@muada.com> On 17-feb-05, at 22:07, Christian Nickel wrote: >> So how did we end up in the current x.x.x.x.ip6.arpa situation? I >> haven't >> been able to find any document that mandates this, what gives? > just read RFC3363 and you get all the answers you need :-) Actually it doesn't, but at least more than 3364. (Am I the only one who is annoyed by the large numbers of RFCs about the same subject??) > current standard is ip6.arpa in nibble format > bitstring format is now experimental > ip6.int is dead :-) Actually that's not what it says. RFC 3363 (which is "informational" itself!) says the whole 2x7x series is now experimental, so bit labels are out the door. 3152 (which is BCP 49) says ip6.int is deprecated and ip6.arpa is the way to go, and references 2874. Neither says in so many words that we should be doing ip6.arpa in nibble mode, and I think it's a pretty big leap of faith to assume that this is what the combination of these RFCs means to say. In any event, there is a severe breach of IETF procedure because a BCP references an RFC that is demoted to "experimental" in an "informational" RFC. From iljitsch at muada.com Thu Feb 17 13:50:21 2005 From: iljitsch at muada.com (Iljitsch van Beijnum) Date: Thu Feb 17 13:50:36 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> Message-ID: <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> On 17-feb-05, at 22:03, Tim Bosserman wrote: > I believe the RFC you are looking for is 3596: DNS Extensions to > Support IP Version 6. It officially obsoletes 1886 and 3152. Thanks, that's the one. Still, 3152 is BCP while 3596 is draft standard. Then to think someone who will remain nameless to protect the guilty wanted to obsolete ip6.int last year, less than a year after the publication of RFC 3596... From jeroen at unfix.org Thu Feb 17 14:17:23 2005 From: jeroen at unfix.org (Jeroen Massar) Date: Thu Feb 17 14:18:43 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> Message-ID: <1108678643.3565.59.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> On Thu, 2005-02-17 at 22:50 +0100, Iljitsch van Beijnum wrote: >On 17-feb-05, at 22:03, Tim Bosserman wrote: > >> I believe the RFC you are looking for is 3596: DNS Extensions to >> Support IP Version 6. It officially obsoletes 1886 and 3152. > >Thanks, that's the one. Still, 3152 is BCP while 3596 is draft standard. > >Then to think someone who will remain nameless to protect the guilty >wanted to obsolete ip6.int last year, less than a year after the >publication of RFC 3596... You didn't see: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ draft-huston-ip6-int-01.txt yet? Btw if you had read my version, which is still online and in google, you would have known about 3596. As the whole ip6.arpa thing is just flaky how it came into existence, just think of it this way: the agreement is there, people are using ip6.arpa, just use it. Nothing to change about it, if you, me or any number of people don't like it. It is for the good anyway, ever checked the state of ip6.int ? :) Greets, Jeroen -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 240 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://mailman.isi.edu/pipermail/6bone/attachments/20050217/a67ca002/attachment.bin From iljitsch at muada.com Thu Feb 17 14:49:26 2005 From: iljitsch at muada.com (Iljitsch van Beijnum) Date: Thu Feb 17 14:49:50 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <1108678643.3565.59.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> <1108678643.3565.59.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> Message-ID: <5e93e995706b27198aa394efd0c7fae2@muada.com> On 17-feb-05, at 23:17, Jeroen Massar wrote: >> Then to think someone who will remain nameless to protect the guilty >> wanted to obsolete ip6.int last year, less than a year after the >> publication of RFC 3596... I meant "shut down". > You didn't see: > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ draft-huston-ip6-int-01.txt > yet? Nope... 5648 unread messages in my ietf-announce box. :-) What is the purpose of this document anyway? ip6.int is deprecated, no need to beat a dead horse. > the agreement is there, people are using ip6.arpa, just use it. Sure. Wasn't there talk that Cisco still did ip6.int? But unless I'm very much mistaken my little ADSL Cisco running 12.3 does ip6.arpa. Now if the makers of host and nslookup throw out the bit labels I'd be very happy. (Weird how these programs are completely anonymous: no way to find out where they come from or what version they are.) > Nothing to change about it, if you, me or any number of people don't > like it. It is for the good anyway, ever checked the state of ip6.int > ? :) No, how would I do something like that? I don't want to start a whole big thing (well, not another one anyway) but it would make a lot of sense to me to just continue to run ip6.int. That's bound to be less trouble than trying to remove it. If nobody wants delegations, then keeping it around is no trouble. If lots of people want delegations, then apparently it still serves some purpose so removing it wouldn't be good. In either case, no upside to removing it at this point in time. And yes, I'm keeping 3ffe:2500:310::/48 for as long as I can hold on to it, too. :-) P.S.: http://a6.muada.nl/ (ducking) From Marc.Williams at neustar.biz Fri Feb 18 07:07:36 2005 From: Marc.Williams at neustar.biz (Williams, Marc) Date: Fri Feb 18 07:08:44 2005 Subject: [6bone] RE: 6bone Digest, Vol 14, Issue 6 Message-ID: <165FCC93A820D240A62F98E028CEFED0018B52C7@stntexch01.cis.neustar.com> I've been running SunOS since microsoft was better known as DOS 3, and we had to load something called crynware to use a 16-bit tcp/ip app. Marc Williams WAN Engineer NeuStar, Inc. mailto:marc.williams@neustar.biz 571-434-5626 (desk) 571-283-1587 (mobile) > -----Original Message----- > Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:31:23 +0800 > From: "Gav" > Subject: [6bone] Solaris > To: <6bone@mailman.isi.edu> > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Are Sun now getting their act together.? > > To those in the know, after looking at > http://www.sun.com/software/solaris/ds/network_performance.jsp > does Solaris 10 now beat the likes of MS and *BSD.? > > I'm downloading it now anyway to give it a test run. > > It would be nice to have one or two IPv6 only apps to try out on it. > > Anyone use Solaris? > > Gav... From gert at space.net Sun Feb 20 05:34:46 2005 From: gert at space.net (Gert Doering) Date: Sun Feb 20 05:35:34 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> Message-ID: <20050220133446.GN84850@Space.Net> Hi, On Thu, Feb 17, 2005 at 10:50:21PM +0100, Iljitsch van Beijnum wrote: > Then to think someone who will remain nameless to protect the guilty > wanted to obsolete ip6.int last year, less than a year after the > publication of RFC 3596... It's the only logical thing to deprecate ip6.int FAST. Maintenance of two DNS hierarchies with mostly identical content (but not fully so, think of delegations of zones where the destination server only carries ip6.arpa) poses quite some burden on the DNS ops - and hardly serves any purpose. Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- Total number of prefixes smaller than registry allocations: 71007 (66629) SpaceNet AG Mail: netmaster@Space.Net Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 Tel : +49-89-32356-0 80807 Muenchen Fax : +49-89-32356-299 From iljitsch at muada.com Sun Feb 20 07:44:36 2005 From: iljitsch at muada.com (Iljitsch van Beijnum) Date: Sun Feb 20 07:45:28 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <20050220133446.GN84850@Space.Net> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> <20050220133446.GN84850@Space.Net> Message-ID: On 20-feb-05, at 14:34, Gert Doering wrote: >> Then to think someone who will remain nameless to protect the guilty >> wanted to obsolete ip6.int last year, less than a year after the >> publication of RFC 3596... > It's the only logical thing to deprecate ip6.int FAST. No, the only logical thing is when you choose to do something under ip6.int, is to stick with it and not move to ip6.arpa for purely cosmetic reasons. But that boat has sailed two years ago. > Maintenance of two DNS hierarchies with mostly identical content (but > not > fully so, think of delegations of zones where the destination server > only > carries ip6.arpa) poses quite some burden on the DNS ops - and hardly > serves any purpose. I have a very hard time believing that both are true. If nobody uses it anymore, then keeping existing ip6.int stuff around is 0 work, so that's certainly the easiest option. If people actually use it, then yes, it is a burden, but apparently it serves a purpose. In this case too, it would be better to keep ip6.int. BTW, anyone know if bitlabels were ever delegated under ip6.arpa? It doesn't look like they are now, but they may have been in the past and/or I'm asking the roots for it in the wrong way. From brian at innovationslab.net Mon Feb 21 07:32:31 2005 From: brian at innovationslab.net (Brian Haberman) Date: Mon Feb 21 07:33:32 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <5e93e995706b27198aa394efd0c7fae2@muada.com> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> <1108678643.3565.59.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> <5e93e995706b27198aa394efd0c7fae2@muada.com> Message-ID: On Feb 17, 2005, at 17:49, Iljitsch van Beijnum wrote: > On 17-feb-05, at 23:17, Jeroen Massar wrote: > >>> Then to think someone who will remain nameless to protect the guilty >>> wanted to obsolete ip6.int last year, less than a year after the >>> publication of RFC 3596... > > I meant "shut down". > >> You didn't see: > >> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ draft-huston-ip6-int-01.txt > >> yet? > > Nope... 5648 unread messages in my ietf-announce box. :-) > > What is the purpose of this document anyway? ip6.int is deprecated, no > need to beat a dead horse. The goal is to get the registries to act asap on cleaning up the DNS hierarchy. If anyone has comments on this draft, the authors (and the IAB) would love to hear them! As background, this draft is a part of a larger effort by the IAB to help get the registries all working from the correct set of RFCs. Regards, Brian -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/pkcs7-signature Size: 2377 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://mailman.isi.edu/pipermail/6bone/attachments/20050221/426775fa/smime.bin From iljitsch at muada.com Mon Feb 21 10:22:02 2005 From: iljitsch at muada.com (Iljitsch van Beijnum) Date: Mon Feb 21 10:23:38 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> <1108678643.3565.59.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> <5e93e995706b27198aa394efd0c7fae2@muada.com> Message-ID: <6da2ab6f5ec401c2a75e242b36a692d3@muada.com> On 21-feb-05, at 16:32, Brian Haberman wrote: >>> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ draft-huston-ip6-int-01.txt >> What is the purpose of this document anyway? ip6.int is deprecated, >> no need to beat a dead horse. > The goal is to get the registries to act asap on cleaning up > the DNS hierarchy. If anyone has comments on this draft, the > authors (and the IAB) would love to hear them! > As background, this draft is a part of a larger effort by the IAB to > help get the registries all working from the correct set of RFCs. Ok, I see. In that case, I would strongly recommend including the status of bitlabel delegations under ip6.arpa as per RFC 2874. Since this RFC is now "experimental" as I understand. Since it's hard to experiment without any delegations, it seems that there should be some form of bitlabel delegation. If only we had a global IPv6 testbed where we could do experiments like this without getting in the way of production stuff... On the other hand, even though the resolvers themselves don't seem to use bitlabels, there are still utilities such as "host" and "nslookup" floating around that do bitlabel lookups for IPv6 addresses, which isn't good. The usefulness of an RFC like this would be to present the whole picture. The individual pieces are already out there (RFCs 3152 and 3596). The june 1st date seems a bit ambitious. Why not stop new delegations immediately, and remove existing ones per 1-1-6 or 6-6-6? From L at bnmnetworks.net Mon Feb 21 10:44:22 2005 From: L at bnmnetworks.net (Scott Nelson) Date: Mon Feb 21 10:45:32 2005 Subject: [6bone] Cisco and NAT question References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl><421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net><56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com><567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com><1108678643.3565.59.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com><5e93e995706b27198aa394efd0c7fae2@muada.com> Message-ID: <003e01c51845$5c54ab70$6f0714ac@suite102> Can NAT be setup to NAT ipv6 to ipv6 from one interface to the other? ISP1 ISP2 ISP3 | | | router | | Client/Network connections I want to statically route all of ISP 2 and ISP 3 network ranges to them via their connections while using ISP's 1 network range for everything else. ISP1, 2 and 3 are tunnels. Client/Network connections are and fast ethernet and a 10Mb ethernet. BGP would be great except that I can't get anyone to call me back so, I am exploring this option while I am waiting for them to call ( if ever ). Free tunnels are great but.............. ;-) Anyway, I have been working on it for a couple of days now and can't seem to get this working. So, what I need is to NAT overload ISP2 and ISP3 from my network ranges. That's the part that I am having an issue with. Routing is already pushing the traffic for those networks out the correct tunnels via static route to each tunnel. Anybody doing IPv6 NAT overload via Cisco or have an idea how to get this working? TIA Scotty From frlinux at frlinux.net Mon Feb 21 11:09:49 2005 From: frlinux at frlinux.net (FRLinux) Date: Mon Feb 21 11:10:30 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> <20050220133446.GN84850@Space.Net> Message-ID: <421A31FD.90001@frlinux.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Iljitsch van Beijnum wrote: | On 20-feb-05, at 14:34, Gert Doering wrote: | I have a very hard time believing that both are true. If nobody uses it | anymore, then keeping existing ip6.int stuff around is 0 work, so that's | certainly the easiest option. If people actually use it, then yes, it is | a burden, but apparently it serves a purpose. In this case too, it would | be better to keep ip6.int. I disagree with that. I have started ipv6 with ip6.arpa until i noticed that some sites on the outside world couldn't resolve properly (read, were taking a long time to resolve, it successful) which is why i *had to* use ip6.int as well for our (read, both home and work, since i work in a place which likes ipv6) zone. I am one of these who actually like ip6.arpa much more than ip6.int, it is my own belief that it makes actually more sense. So if tomorrow, someone tells me ip6.int can be safely removed from my DNS, i will be more than happy. Steph - -- Mail sent on Gentoo Linux (http://www.gentoo.org) http://frlinux.net - frlinux@frlinux.net public key : http://frlinux.net/files/frlinux_public_key.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFCGjH9plbM2wjOZgMRAlycAJ0a7JBmxWVmttacx8YE0Ko5F5fy2ACcCq83 GlOG66BuxbZ8ojufjv/fO7M= =ISCU -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From iljitsch at muada.com Mon Feb 21 11:32:56 2005 From: iljitsch at muada.com (Iljitsch van Beijnum) Date: Mon Feb 21 11:34:34 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <421A31FD.90001@frlinux.net> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> <20050220133446.GN84850@Space.Net> <421A31FD.90001@frlinux.net> Message-ID: On 21-feb-05, at 20:09, FRLinux wrote: > I have started ipv6 with ip6.arpa until i noticed > that some sites on the outside world couldn't resolve properly (read, > were taking a long time to resolve, it successful) which is why i *had > to* use ip6.int as well for our (read, both home and work, since i work > in a place which likes ipv6) zone. I am one of these who actually like > ip6.arpa much more than ip6.int, it is my own belief that it makes > actually more sense. So if tomorrow, someone tells me ip6.int can be > safely removed from my DNS, i will be more than happy. Apparently you don't understand that when your ip6.int delegation is removed your original troubles will reappear. (Unless the stuff that created the problems has been upgraded to look for ip6.arpa in the mean time.) I wish someone could tell me who had this bright idea of switching to nibbles in ip6.arpa in the first place... From L at bnmnetworks.net Mon Feb 21 12:06:46 2005 From: L at bnmnetworks.net (Scott Nelson) Date: Mon Feb 21 12:07:31 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl><4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> <20050220133446.GN84850@Space.Net> <421A31FD.90001@frlinux.net> Message-ID: <000a01c51850$deeecf10$6f0714ac@suite102> > Iljitsch van Beijnum wrote: > | On 20-feb-05, at 14:34, Gert Doering wrote: > | I have a very hard time believing that both are true. If nobody uses it > | anymore, then keeping existing ip6.int stuff around is 0 work, so that's > | certainly the easiest option. If people actually use it, then yes, it is > | a burden, but apparently it serves a purpose. In this case too, it would > | be better to keep ip6.int. > > I disagree with that. I have started ipv6 with ip6.arpa until i noticed > that some sites on the outside world couldn't resolve properly (read, > were taking a long time to resolve, it successful) which is why i *had > to* use ip6.int as well for our (read, both home and work, since i work > in a place which likes ipv6) zone. I am one of these who actually like > ip6.arpa much more than ip6.int, it is my own belief that it makes > actually more sense. So if tomorrow, someone tells me ip6.int can be > safely removed from my DNS, i will be more than happy. > > Steph -->Traceroute-ing to www.isc.org and I see that verio still uses .int for their stuff. It's one of those YMMV things until all of the old 6bone stuff is gone/converted. Scotty From jorgen at hovland.cx Mon Feb 21 12:18:29 2005 From: jorgen at hovland.cx (=?iso-8859-1?Q?J=F8rgen_Hovland?=) Date: Mon Feb 21 12:20:29 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl><4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> <20050220133446.GN84850@Space.Net> <421A31FD.90001@frlinux.net> Message-ID: <001501c51852$830c6660$db401cac@jorgen> ----- Original Message ----- From: "FRLinux" > Iljitsch van Beijnum wrote: > | On 20-feb-05, at 14:34, Gert Doering wrote: > | I have a very hard time believing that both are true. If nobody uses it > | anymore, then keeping existing ip6.int stuff around is 0 work, so that's > | certainly the easiest option. If people actually use it, then yes, it is > | a burden, but apparently it serves a purpose. In this case too, it would > | be better to keep ip6.int. > > I disagree with that. I have started ipv6 with ip6.arpa until i noticed > that some sites on the outside world couldn't resolve properly (read, > were taking a long time to resolve, it successful) which is why i *had > to* use ip6.int as well for our (read, both home and work, since i work > in a place which likes ipv6) zone. I am one of these who actually like > ip6.arpa much more than ip6.int, it is my own belief that it makes > actually more sense. So if tomorrow, someone tells me ip6.int can be > safely removed from my DNS, i will be more than happy. > > Steph Hi You are not alone with that point of view. We are not removing anything if it is still being used due to backwards compability. Besides it doesn't cost us anything (time, money, resources) to run dual. When nobody/a very low percentage is querying our .int zone, which could be some time in 2015 or even later (or maybe never?), we will remove it. Joergen Hovland ENK From pekkas at netcore.fi Mon Feb 21 12:24:57 2005 From: pekkas at netcore.fi (Pekka Savola) Date: Mon Feb 21 12:26:33 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> <20050220133446.GN84850@Space.Net> <421A31FD.90001@frlinux.net> Message-ID: On Mon, 21 Feb 2005, Iljitsch van Beijnum wrote: > On 21-feb-05, at 20:09, FRLinux wrote: >> I have started ipv6 with ip6.arpa until i noticed >> that some sites on the outside world couldn't resolve properly (read, >> were taking a long time to resolve, it successful) which is why i *had >> to* use ip6.int as well for our (read, both home and work, since i work >> in a place which likes ipv6) zone. I am one of these who actually like >> ip6.arpa much more than ip6.int, it is my own belief that it makes >> actually more sense. So if tomorrow, someone tells me ip6.int can be >> safely removed from my DNS, i will be more than happy. > > Apparently you don't understand that when your ip6.int delegation is removed > your original troubles will reappear. > > (Unless the stuff that created the problems has been upgraded to look for > ip6.arpa in the mean time.) There are some more serious issues as well, if they appeared recently. Bind 9.3.0 removed support for bitstring queries, so if you: - run BIND 9.3.0 as your caching server, and - your hosts' resolver libraries send ip6.arpa records in bitstring format, while ip6.int queries are sent in nibbles (e.g., RHL9, maybe others) .. You'll experience about 30-40 seconds of delay when you try to log on using SSH. Bind 9.2.4 and earlier work fine. Yes, this has been reported to Bind fellows, and closed as "working as designed." Sigh.. -- Pekka Savola "You each name yourselves king, yet the Netcore Oy kingdom bleeds." Systems. Networks. Security. -- George R.R. Martin: A Clash of Kings From frlinux at frlinux.net Mon Feb 21 12:44:53 2005 From: frlinux at frlinux.net (FRLinux) Date: Mon Feb 21 12:45:30 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> <20050220133446.GN84850@Space.Net> <421A31FD.90001@frlinux.net> Message-ID: <421A4845.8060409@frlinux.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Iljitsch van Beijnum wrote: | Apparently you don't understand that when your ip6.int delegation is | removed your original troubles will reappear. | | (Unless the stuff that created the problems has been upgraded to look | for ip6.arpa in the mean time.) Well i don't think it has been. One thing i have to understand is my users telling me they experienced delays in looking some sites and/or ssh'ing to other universities, which of course they blame on the admin (me, in this case) as they don't understand what ipv6 is about and/or why it is good to run it. As Pekka also posted, Bind 9.3 is looking a bit worrying to me since i don't want network delays to happen. Steph - -- Mail sent on Gentoo Linux (http://www.gentoo.org) http://frlinux.net - frlinux@frlinux.net public key : http://frlinux.net/files/frlinux_public_key.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFCGkhFplbM2wjOZgMRAjzsAKCCwtEhlSSwjc4LAw9Se/0Ag9AfnACfT7bb C5JWqKFvvygR3ueGgqux80U= =ilQd -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From iljitsch at muada.com Mon Feb 21 13:27:41 2005 From: iljitsch at muada.com (Iljitsch van Beijnum) Date: Mon Feb 21 13:28:43 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> <20050220133446.GN84850@Space.Net> <421A31FD.90001@frlinux.net> Message-ID: <5d663170388c657f4546291fa287ede9@muada.com> On 21-feb-05, at 21:24, Pekka Savola wrote: > Bind 9.3.0 removed support for bitstring queries, so if you: > - run BIND 9.3.0 as your caching server, and > - your hosts' resolver libraries send ip6.arpa records in bitstring > format, while ip6.int queries are sent in nibbles (e.g., RHL9, maybe > others) My somewhat aging Red Hat Linux 9 system doesn't do this: root@torreya root]# uname -a Linux torreya 2.4.20-8 #1 Thu Mar 13 17:54:28 EST 2003 i686 i686 i386 GNU/Linux 22:16:28.341283 torreya.muada.com.32773 > sequoia.muada.com.domain: [udp sum ok] 58539+ PTR? e.5.a.a.5.3.e.f.f.f.0.7.0.6.2.0.0.0.0.0.6.0.0.0.8.f.a.1.1.0.0.2.ip6.arpa . (90) (len 98, hlim 63) 22:16:28.341661 sequoia.muada.com.domain > torreya.muada.com.32773: [udp sum ok] 58539 NXDomain* 0/1/0 (148) (len 156, hlim 64) 22:16:28.356711 torreya.muada.com.32773 > sequoia.muada.com.domain: [udp sum ok] 58540+ PTR? e.5.a.a.5.3.e.f.f.f.0.7.0.6.2.0.0.0.0.0.6.0.0.0.8.f.a.1.1.0.0.2.ip6.int. (89) (len 97, hlim 63) [...] 22:16:47.970774 torreya.muada.com.32773 > sequoia.muada.com.domain: [udp sum ok] 58558+ PTR? d.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.8.f.4.0.1.0.0.2.ip6.arpa . (90) (len 98, hlim 63) 22:16:47.971687 sequoia.muada.com.domain > torreya.muada.com.32773: [udp sum ok] 58558 1/5/3 d.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.8.f.4.0.1.0.0.2.ip6.arpa . PTR www.isc.org. (287) (len 295, hlim 64) The first two lines are for an address that doesn't have any reverse mapping, and it asks for ip6.arpa and then ip6.int. For the last two lines ip6.arpa works so it doesn't do ip6.int. (Scott: Verio has both ip6.arpa and ip6.int. That's doing the right thing, because this works if your system asks for ip6.arpa but also if it asks for ip6.int. The real question is why in your case, it seems to ask for ip6.int.) But bitlabels never enter the picture. I installed this system somewhere in the second half of 2003. I can't imagine they changed it to look up bitlabels after this... (But then, I never understood why people use Linux for network stuff in the first place, when *BSD does it so much better.) > .. You'll experience about 30-40 seconds of delay when you try to log > on using SSH. Bind 9.2.4 and earlier work fine. ??? As far as I can tell, there are no bitlabel delegations, so how would this work? And why would there be a delay? BIND 9.3.0 doesn't support bitlabels so I assume it returns an error so there shouldn't be any delays. > Yes, this has been reported to Bind fellows, and closed as "working > as designed." > Sigh.. I see your "sigh" and I raise you a "yuck". I'm sticking with BIND 9.2. From gert at space.net Mon Feb 21 13:34:01 2005 From: gert at space.net (Gert Doering) Date: Mon Feb 21 13:34:30 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <421A31FD.90001@frlinux.net> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> <20050220133446.GN84850@Space.Net> <421A31FD.90001@frlinux.net> Message-ID: <20050221213401.GC84850@Space.Net> Hi, On Mon, Feb 21, 2005 at 07:09:49PM +0000, FRLinux wrote: > I disagree with that. I have started ipv6 with ip6.arpa until i noticed > that some sites on the outside world couldn't resolve properly (read, > were taking a long time to resolve, it successful) which is why i *had > to* use ip6.int as well for our (read, both home and work, since i work > in a place which likes ipv6) zone. And *this* is why ip6.int should be have been switched off at the root, one year ago. Not even a "big bang", more a "slight puff", and then people get to finally upgrade their broken software. Your way, we get to support ip6.int forever, because there's always a broken system out there to babysit for. (I'm not sure either why a non-existing ip6.int delegation - as opposed to a lame delegation - would lead to "slow DNS resolving", though) Gert Doering -- NetMaster -- Total number of prefixes smaller than registry allocations: 71007 (66629) SpaceNet AG Mail: netmaster@Space.Net Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 Tel : +49-89-32356-0 80807 Muenchen Fax : +49-89-32356-299 From tjc at ecs.soton.ac.uk Mon Feb 21 15:22:59 2005 From: tjc at ecs.soton.ac.uk (Tim Chown) Date: Mon Feb 21 15:23:30 2005 Subject: [6bone] Cisco and NAT question In-Reply-To: <003e01c51845$5c54ab70$6f0714ac@suite102> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <003e01c51845$5c54ab70$6f0714ac@suite102> Message-ID: <20050221232259.GB14387@login.ecs.soton.ac.uk> Hi Scott, Why use IPv6 at all if you are using NAT, why not just use IPv4? I think it's good if Cisco don't support IPv6 NAT operations ;) Tim On Mon, Feb 21, 2005 at 01:44:22PM -0500, Scott Nelson wrote: > Can NAT be setup to NAT ipv6 to ipv6 from one interface to the other? > > ISP1 ISP2 ISP3 > | | | > router > | | > Client/Network connections > > > I want to statically route all of ISP 2 and ISP 3 network ranges to them > via their connections while using ISP's 1 network range for everything else. > ISP1, 2 and 3 are tunnels. Client/Network connections are and fast ethernet > and a 10Mb ethernet. > > BGP would be great except that I can't get anyone to call me back so, I am > exploring this option while I am waiting for them to call ( if ever ). > Free tunnels are great but.............. ;-) > > Anyway, I have been working on it for a couple of days now and can't seem to > get this working. > So, what I need is to NAT overload ISP2 and ISP3 from my network ranges. > That's the part that I am having an issue with. > Routing is already pushing the traffic for those networks out the correct > tunnels via static route to each tunnel. > > Anybody doing IPv6 NAT overload via Cisco or have an idea how to get this > working? > > TIA > > Scotty > > > _______________________________________________ > 6bone mailing list > 6bone@mailman.isi.edu > http://mailman.isi.edu/mailman/listinfo/6bone -- Tim From L at bnmnetworks.net Mon Feb 21 17:32:41 2005 From: L at bnmnetworks.net (Scott Nelson) Date: Mon Feb 21 17:33:29 2005 Subject: [6bone] Cisco and NAT question References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl><003e01c51845$5c54ab70$6f0714ac@suite102> <20050221232259.GB14387@login.ecs.soton.ac.uk> Message-ID: <001301c5187e$666aac20$6f0714ac@suite102> Because I am trying to do a "poor mans" BGP and bleed of the traffic for/to certain networks to cut down on the peering point latency. Your right though, won't do much good for the incoming traffic, thinking about it now. :-( Scotty ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim Chown" To: <6bone@mailman.isi.edu> Sent: Monday, February 21, 2005 18:22 Subject: Re: [6bone] Cisco and NAT question > Hi Scott, > > Why use IPv6 at all if you are using NAT, why not just use IPv4? > > I think it's good if Cisco don't support IPv6 NAT operations ;) > > Tim > > On Mon, Feb 21, 2005 at 01:44:22PM -0500, Scott Nelson wrote: > > Can NAT be setup to NAT ipv6 to ipv6 from one interface to the other? > > > > ISP1 ISP2 ISP3 > > | | | > > router > > | | > > Client/Network connections > > > > > > I want to statically route all of ISP 2 and ISP 3 network ranges to them > > via their connections while using ISP's 1 network range for everything else. > > ISP1, 2 and 3 are tunnels. Client/Network connections are and fast ethernet > > and a 10Mb ethernet. > > > > BGP would be great except that I can't get anyone to call me back so, I am > > exploring this option while I am waiting for them to call ( if ever ). > > Free tunnels are great but.............. ;-) > > > > Anyway, I have been working on it for a couple of days now and can't seem to > > get this working. > > So, what I need is to NAT overload ISP2 and ISP3 from my network ranges. > > That's the part that I am having an issue with. > > Routing is already pushing the traffic for those networks out the correct > > tunnels via static route to each tunnel. > > > > Anybody doing IPv6 NAT overload via Cisco or have an idea how to get this > > working? > > > > TIA > > > > Scotty > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > 6bone mailing list > > 6bone@mailman.isi.edu > > http://mailman.isi.edu/mailman/listinfo/6bone > > -- > Tim > > > _______________________________________________ > 6bone mailing list > 6bone@mailman.isi.edu > http://mailman.isi.edu/mailman/listinfo/6bone > From oh2kku at iki.fi Mon Feb 21 17:53:33 2005 From: oh2kku at iki.fi (Tapio Sokura) Date: Mon Feb 21 17:54:32 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <20050221213401.GC84850@Space.Net> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> <20050220133446.GN84850@Space.Net> <421A31FD.90001@frlinux.net> <20050221213401.GC84850@Space.Net> Message-ID: <421A909D.9070001@iki.fi> Gert Doering wrote: > And *this* is why ip6.int should be have been switched off at the root, > one year ago. Not even a "big bang", more a "slight puff", and then > people get to finally upgrade their broken software. I agree with Gert. I am seeing significant slowdowns with initiating v6-connections as well due to the DNS issues (int/arpa and bitstring/nibble). In my opinion, the situation would not get (much) worse if ip6.int and bitstrings stopped working today. If something seems to almost work, people rarely touch it. But if it (= ip6.int and bitstrings) break completely, the fixes could be in software a lot faster. The change will hit harder the later it is made. Maybe a heads-up warning is in order beforehands, but the time from the warning to the time the big switch is hit should not need to be more than a few months at maximum.. Tapio From spz at serpens.de Mon Feb 21 22:23:41 2005 From: spz at serpens.de (S.P.Zeidler) Date: Mon Feb 21 22:24:47 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa Message-ID: <20050222062340.GA9920@serpens.de> Hi, .int and .arpa are all the same to me (provided we don't get to switch every two years, that is :), but I liked bitstring format. regards, spz -- spz@serpens.de (S.P.Zeidler) From pekkas at netcore.fi Mon Feb 21 23:04:41 2005 From: pekkas at netcore.fi (Pekka Savola) Date: Mon Feb 21 23:05:30 2005 Subject: [6bone] .int / .arpa In-Reply-To: <5d663170388c657f4546291fa287ede9@muada.com> References: <20050203095700.GB5933@xs4all.nl> <4212F061.8040104@zehs.com.pl> <421387C0.7000408@enterzone.net> <56c1210ebe27841e2b3f9600f41ecc1d@muada.com> <567b00957394b445516a24605a0b247a@muada.com> <20050220133446.GN84850@Space.Net> <421A31FD.90001@frlinux.net> <5d663170388c657f4546291fa287ede9@muada.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 21 Feb 2005, Iljitsch van Beijnum wrote: > My somewhat aging Red Hat Linux 9 system doesn't do this: [...] > But bitlabels never enter the picture. > > I installed this system somewhere in the second half of 2003. I can't imagine > they changed it to look up bitlabels after this... In fact, they did -- this change was part of (misguided) glibc bugfix errata :-( * Thu Oct 30 2003 Jakub Jelinek 2.3.2-27.9.2 - fix getnameinfo and getaddrinfo with reverse IPv6 lookups (#101261) > And why would there be a delay? BIND 9.3.0 doesn't support bitlabels so I > assume it returns an error so there shouldn't be any delays. The problem is that glibc resolver (I don't know of others) does not react immediately when it gets a Format Error message -- but rather waits for 10 seconds or so. Yep, this has been reported to glibc folks as well ... -- Pekka Savola "You each name yourselves king, yet the Netcore Oy kingdom bleeds." Systems. Networks. Security. -- George R.R. Martin: A Clash of Kings From hank at mail.iucc.ac.il Mon Feb 28 01:44:14 2005 From: hank at mail.iucc.ac.il (Hank Nussbacher) Date: Mon Feb 28 01:51:43 2005 Subject: [6bone] Long BGP AS set via IPv6 Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050228114203.00a85818@mail.iucc.ac.il> Anyone have a clue why this is happening? This is coming from Universita' degli Studi di Roma "La Sapienza" (caspur.it). Time is GMT-2: Feb 27 19:54:16: %BGP-6-ASPATH: Long AS path 20965 1299 3320 15589 15589 5397 {33,109,145,293,559,816,1103,1273,1275,1752,1853,1930,2042,2200,2497,2500,2914,3257,3265,3333,3352,3425,3549,4691,4697,4716,4725,5511,5539,5609,5623,6175,6435,6453,6762,6830,6939,7580,7660,8447,8472,8763,9264,10566,12779,12793,12859,13944,14277,15897,17715,17965,24136,24895,25358,29377,29686,31103,32266} received from 2001:798:201B:10AA::1: More than configured MAXAS-LIMIT Feb 27 19:57:47: %BGP-6-ASPATH: Long AS path 20965 1299 3320 15589 15589 5397 {109,145,559,816,1103,1273,1275,1752,1853,1930,2042,2200,2497,2500,2914,3257,3265,3333,3352,3425,3549,4691,4697,4716,4725,5511,5539,5623,6175,6435,6453,6762,6830,6939,7580,7660,8447,8472,8763,9264,10566,12779,12793,12859,13944,14277,15897,17715,17965,24136,24895,25358,29377,29686,31103,32266} received from 2001:798:201B:10AA::1: More than configured MAXAS-LIMIT Feb 27 20:16:06: %BGP-6-ASPATH: Long AS path 20965 11537 17579 293 3320 3320 15589 15589 5397 {109,145,559,816,1103,1273,1275,1752,1853,1930,2042,2200,2497,2500,2914,3257,3265,3333,3352,3425,3549,4691,4697,4716,4725,5511,5539,5623,6175,6435,6453,6762,6830,6939,7580,7660,8447,8472,8763,9264,10566,12779,12793,12859,13944,14277,15897,17715,17965,24136,24895,25358,29377,29686,31103,32266} received from 2001:798:201B:10AA::1: More than configured MAXAS-LIMIT Hopefully no router fell over because of it. -Hank From gabriella.paolini at garr.it Mon Feb 28 01:56:53 2005 From: gabriella.paolini at garr.it (Gabriella Paolini) Date: Mon Feb 28 01:59:42 2005 Subject: [6bone] [Fwd: Long BGP AS set via IPv6] Message-ID: <4222EAE5.7090406@garr.it> Gabriele, Maurizio, could you explain what's happening? thanks, Gabriella -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Long BGP AS set via IPv6 Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 11:44:14 +0200 From: Hank Nussbacher To: geantv6@dante.org.uk, 6bone@ISI.EDU Anyone have a clue why this is happening? This is coming from Universita' degli Studi di Roma "La Sapienza" (caspur.it). Time is GMT-2: Feb 27 19:54:16: %BGP-6-ASPATH: Long AS path 20965 1299 3320 15589 15589 5397 {33,109,145,293,559,816,1103,1273,1275,1752,1853,1930,2042,2200,2497,2500,2914,3257,3265,3333,3352,3425,3549,4691,4697,4716,4725,5511,5539,5609,5623,6175,6435,6453,6762,6830,6939,7580,7660,8447,8472,8763,9264,10566,12779,12793,12859,13944,14277,15897,17715,17965,24136,24895,25358,29377,29686,31103,32266} received from 2001:798:201B:10AA::1: More than configured MAXAS-LIMIT Feb 27 19:57:47: %BGP-6-ASPATH: Long AS path 20965 1299 3320 15589 15589 5397 {109,145,559,816,1103,1273,1275,1752,1853,1930,2042,2200,2497,2500,2914,3257,3265,3333,3352,3425,3549,4691,4697,4716,4725,5511,5539,5623,6175,6435,6453,6762,6830,6939,7580,7660,8447,8472,8763,9264,10566,12779,12793,12859,13944,14277,15897,17715,17965,24136,24895,25358,29377,29686,31103,32266} received from 2001:798:201B:10AA::1: More than configured MAXAS-LIMIT Feb 27 20:16:06: %BGP-6-ASPATH: Long AS path 20965 11537 17579 293 3320 3320 15589 15589 5397 {109,145,559,816,1103,1273,1275,1752,1853,1930,2042,2200,2497,2500,2914,3257,3265,3333,3352,3425,3549,4691,4697,4716,4725,5511,5539,5623,6175,6435,6453,6762,6830,6939,7580,7660,8447,8472,8763,9264,10566,12779,12793,12859,13944,14277,15897,17715,17965,24136,24895,25358,29377,29686,31103,32266} received from 2001:798:201B:10AA::1: More than configured MAXAS-LIMIT Hopefully no router fell over because of it. -Hank -- Gabriella Paolini -------------------------------------------------- GARR - The Italian Academic and Research Network V.le Palmiro Togliatti,1625 I-00155 Rome - Italy office: +39 06 433614 33 fax: +39 06 433614 44 m@il: gabriella.paolini@garr.it http://www.garr.it Internet Telephony Nome utente Skype: gabriella.paolini (www.skype.com) ================================================== From iljitsch at muada.com Mon Feb 28 02:51:48 2005 From: iljitsch at muada.com (Iljitsch van Beijnum) Date: Mon Feb 28 02:53:42 2005 Subject: [6bone] Long BGP AS set via IPv6 In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20050228114203.00a85818@mail.iucc.ac.il> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20050228114203.00a85818@mail.iucc.ac.il> Message-ID: <4fe57bcc96c25454bd137d0579e626d1@muada.com> On 28-feb-05, at 10:44, Hank Nussbacher wrote: > Anyone have a clue why this is happening? Looks like someone is aggregating some routes from lots of different sources into a single one. Can you list the prefix(es) and additional attributes, such as ATOMIC_AGGREGATE and AGGREGATOR? From jeroen at unfix.org Mon Feb 28 02:51:16 2005 From: jeroen at unfix.org (Jeroen Massar) Date: Mon Feb 28 02:55:43 2005 Subject: [6bone] Long BGP AS set via IPv6 In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20050228114203.00a85818@mail.iucc.ac.il> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20050228114203.00a85818@mail.iucc.ac.il> Message-ID: <1109587876.9918.72.camel@firenze.zurich.ibm.com> On Mon, 2005-02-28 at 11:44 +0200, Hank Nussbacher wrote: >Anyone have a clue why this is happening? This is coming from Universita' >degli Studi di Roma "La Sapienza" (caspur.it). Time is GMT-2: > >Feb 27 19:54:16: %BGP-6-ASPATH: Long AS path 20965 1299 3320 15589 15589 >5397 >{33,109,145,293,559,816,1103,1273,1275,1752,1853,1930,2042,2200,2497,2500,2914,3257,3265,3333,3352,3425,3549,4691,4697,4716,4725,5511,5539,5609,5623,6175,6435,6453,6762,6830,6939,7580,7660,8447,8472,8763,9264,10566,12779,12793,12859,13944,14277,15897,17715,17965,24136,24895,25358,29377,29686,31103,32266} >received from 2001:798:201B:10AA::1: More than configured MAXAS-LIMIT >Hopefully no router fell over because of it. Actually most likely a router fell over and then keep spitting the above out to the rest of the world. It is quite bad that you actually get it, meaning that no other prefix exists for that prefix. That happens some times with broken implementations :) See http://www.sixxs.net/tools/grh/lg/?show=evilbogons&find=::/0 Btw, the more ASN's provide data to GRH the better it gets ;) "Something" (AS4134) is also announcing 2000:2:2::/64 for the last couple of weeks, and the fun part: there are entities that transit it... Microsoft also seems to be hacked over: inet6num: 3FFE:8310::/28 netname: MICROSOFT descr: Microsoft 6Bone Allocation is now announced by AS17832 (SIXNGIX-AS-KR) and by AS31701 (CONSULINTEL-AS) and by AS9112 (POZNAN). Does this have to do with Teredo? I've CC'd MS, btw Dennis, you might want to add a maintainer to your object... AS31707 mentions: 8<------------------ aut-num: AS31701 as-name: CONSULINTEL-AS descr: Consulintel Autonomous System descr: Temporary AS to be used with 2001:07F9::/32 ------------------->8 Does not look like they should be announcing 6bone space then... Sprint is still transiting for AS10318 :( Greets, Jeroen -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 240 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://mailman.isi.edu/pipermail/6bone/attachments/20050228/65c72819/attachment.bin From hank at mail.iucc.ac.il Mon Feb 28 03:05:26 2005 From: hank at mail.iucc.ac.il (Hank Nussbacher) Date: Mon Feb 28 03:09:44 2005 Subject: [6bone] Long BGP AS set via IPv6 In-Reply-To: <4fe57bcc96c25454bd137d0579e626d1@muada.com> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20050228114203.00a85818@mail.iucc.ac.il> <5.1.0.14.2.20050228114203.00a85818@mail.iucc.ac.il> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20050228130228.05968d18@mail.iucc.ac.il> At 11:51 AM 28-02-05 +0100, Iljitsch van Beijnum wrote: >On 28-feb-05, at 10:44, Hank Nussbacher wrote: > >>Anyone have a clue why this is happening? > >Looks like someone is aggregating some routes from lots of different >sources into a single one. Can you list the prefix(es) and additional >attributes, such as ATOMIC_AGGREGATE and AGGREGATOR? Can't, since maxas-limit causes the router to drop the prefix upon receipt. -Hank From iljitsch at muada.com Mon Feb 28 03:08:43 2005 From: iljitsch at muada.com (Iljitsch van Beijnum) Date: Mon Feb 28 03:09:50 2005 Subject: [6bone] Long BGP AS set via IPv6 In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20050228130228.05968d18@mail.iucc.ac.il> References: <5.1.0.14.2.20050228114203.00a85818@mail.iucc.ac.il> <5.1.0.14.2.20050228114203.00a85818@mail.iucc.ac.il> <5.1.0.14.2.20050228130228.05968d18@mail.iucc.ac.il> Message-ID: <037df2c463657d9bf23d6bfb03e01509@muada.com> On 28-feb-05, at 12:05, Hank Nussbacher wrote: >> Looks like someone is aggregating some routes from lots of different >> sources into a single one. Can you list the prefix(es) and additional >> attributes, such as ATOMIC_AGGREGATE and AGGREGATOR? > Can't, since maxas-limit causes the router to drop the prefix upon > receipt. Cool. :-) Iljitsch