[6bone] Re: pTLA request NDSOFTWARE - review closes 23 October 2002

[John Fraizer]

On Fri, 25 Oct 2002, Abdul Basit wrote:

> Hello folks@6bone ,
> 
>  I like to favour Mr Deffayet on his pTLA request, I am speaking on behalf
> of NextGenCollective (NGC), NGC is a reasearch organization that provides
> ipv6 tunnels to over 150 users , We have NDSOFTWARE as our ipv6
> upstream. NGC is housed at WSU (Wichita state university), USA, As a

Might I suggest that while NGC obviously offers a viable service to your
tunnel "clients", NDSOFTWARE is _not_ a very good choice to provide
transit services to you?

I suggest that you take a look at pTLA holders in the continental US, do
some traceroutes to the v4 addresses they have listed in their tunnel
statements and find one that is close to you for both RTT and physical
topology.

As it stands, if one of your tunnel clients wants to access say,
www.6bone.net via IPv6, the packet has to go from the US to France and
then back across the ocean to Canada.  Not a very well optimized
situation.


> matter of fact, in very begining , we were unable to find any support
> of ipv6 , it was Mr Deffayet who helped us a lot, so its wrong to say that
> he is an offensive person, I see him working almost all the time

His helping you is nice.  It does not change anything else though.


> supporting his customers.  and not to mention NDSOFTWARE does supports
> many research based ipv6 projects, NGC, and IPng are one of them.
> and NGC in turns plan to deploy IPv6 on whole WSU network infrastructure.

And again, I suggest that you find a more viable transit provider.  Is NGC
a university supported activity or are you doing this as a project of your
own.  If in fact it is a university supported activity, you have a wealth
of resources at your disposal.

I am quite certain that there are many pTLA holders in the US that would
be more than happy to help you out.  We appear to be about 70ms and 12
router hops out from you.  While I'm sure that this is better than your
tunnel to NDSOFTWARE, I'm sure that there are other pTLA providers in the
US can provide you a closer connection.  If not, we can help you out.  You
never contacted us when you decided to start your project so, I don't feel
that you looked very hard for help in the US.

> We also plan to tunnel with KU and KSU in cojunction with HiPECC
> (http://www.hipecc.twsu.edu) Internet2 project at WSU. Even we are
> analyzing the feasibility of deploying IPv6 on laptops issued to students.
> NGC is also providing IPSec tunnels to those who wants with dynamic updates.
> We are also planning to look for feasbility for establishing a mobile
> cluster using ipv6.
> http://www.linuxsymposium.org/2002/view_txt.php?text=abstract&talk=36

That is all very neat and I'm glad that you're doing active research in
the v6 field.  None of it lends any more validity to the NDSOFTWARE pTLA
application though.

> 
>  As a matter of fact, being on irc is fun, you meet nice persons
> and get help, it always the case with me.

OK.  If you say so.  Where did that come from?  I though we were talking
about a pTLA application, not IRC.

Top 10 list of things I've found on IRC:

(1) 'leet d00dz plotting their next dDoS.
(2) Pr0n.
(3) People looking for pr0n.
(4) pedofiles looking for their next victim.
(5) potential victims (be it of a dDoS, a pedofile, or both.)
(6) warez
(7) people looking for warez.
(8) Thousands on thousands of bots guarding the electronic "turf" of their
prepubescent "owners."
(9) Thousands on thousands of OTHER bots trying to steal that turf on
behalf of their prepubescent "owners."
(10) prepubescent bot owners bitching about having their "channel" taken
over by some other prepubescent bot owner. 


Obviously, my experience differs from yours.

>  On the other hand, persons working in cisco, motorolla, Nokia are of
> no real help, I tried to contact some persons in Nokia (listed at
> http://www.nokia.com/ipv6/ ) several times , no reply i got, but if i

My you paint with a very wide brush, don't you?  Let me guess.  You sent
an email something along the lines of:

"hello.  i want i should tunnel get from you ipv6 site for my friends and 
me."

Contrary to popular belief, the folks who _work_ at Cisco, Motorola and
Nokia don't get paid to solve the problems of NON-CUSTOMERS.  When they
have the time to do so, and when presented with a detailed description of
a problem which they have the resources to remedy, I find them to be more
than willing to help.

> email Mr Deffayet for some question or ask for some support, i usually
> get reply on the same day. I give credit to Mr Deffayet of what is
> currently being done under NGC as he is the one who is supporting that
> research work. I beleive NOKIA , cisco and other BIG giants don't
> support IPv6 work at universities that much that NDSOFTWARE is trying
> to do.

Are you available for hire as a political spokesperson?  Seriously.  You
have a knack for spin that is only found in true polical pros.

Has your university presented any type of OFFICIAL proposal to any of the
companies you reference above?  Do you have any idea how many non-official
proposals these companies get from individuals?


>  My opinion is , if NDSOFTWARE's request is fully RFC2772 compliant,
                  ^^^
                   |--- If it was RFC2772 compliant, I wouldn't be so
against it.  Have you bothered to read any of the many emails where myself
and others have pointed out RFC2772 violations?


> there should be no objection of approving its pTLA 's request, or
> ppl who are against it should provide strong reasons in terms of RFC2772
> to oppose the request. Its not ONLY the right of BIG organizations
> (like Nokia, Cisco etc) to become pTLA, other relatively small
> organization can serve as a pTLA 's also if they obey the rules
> stated in RFC. We should encourage all.
> 
> - basit
> Graduate Student
> MS Computer Science
> Wichita state university
> http://basit.cc
> http://ip6.basit.cc


I certainly hope that you put more research into your thesis than you did
into your arguement for approval of the NDSOFTWARE pTLA application.  Do
yourself a favor and look back through this thread.  You will find pages
and pages of "strong reasons in terms of RFC2772 to oppose the request."


---
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