[6bone] Re: routing concern

[John Fraizer]

On Wed, 31 Jul 2002, Ronald van der Pol wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 30, 2002 at 11:13:36 -0700, Michel Py wrote:
> 
> > As I said before, the 6bone is the right place for this. Has anyone been
> > hurt? Anyone lost money? The lessons we collectively learn each time
> > someone messes up a route are far more valuable than the consequences of
> > messing up the route.
> 
> Is it time to start making a clear distinction between IPv6 production
> and IPv6 experimentation/learning? I think today the 6bone is used for
> both.
>  
> Many use IPv6 for their daily work *). We *need* a stable network for
> that.  If we don't do that we risk scaring people away from IPv6. Most
> OSes support IPv6 nowadays. When an enduser starts using IPv6 for the
> first time and she notices all kinds of networking problems, many will
> think: "OK, let's turn off IPv6. It does not work."
>  
> The RIR prefixes are meant for IPv6 production. So, I think they should
> not be used on the 6bone. The 6bone should only be used for experiments
> and possibly learning. And on the other hand, I think production services
> should not use 6bone prefixes, but RIR prefixes.
>  
> 	rvdp

If you don't want to see RIR space on your router Ronald, you can filter
it.  I _strongly_ disagree with having a hard seperation of production v6
and 6bone though.  There already exists seperation.  Production services
on production prefixes.  6bone experiments on 6bone prefixes.

Do you really want to create an island out of the production v6
network?  Do you want folks on production v6 address space to not be able
to reach 6bone prefixes?

We're not asking people to stop experimenting.  We're asking them to do so
wisely.  As for scaring people away from v6, I don't see it.  As
confounded as it is, the 6bone is more robust then the initial v4
network.

> *) I frequently use ftp, cvs and http over IPv6 to sites far away in
> the internet. Too often, there are routing problems and IPv6 traffic
> is blackholed (routing loops, etc). Most application time out and try
> IPv4. But this means annoying delays. Many of these problems occur
> because people are running production services over the 6bone.

The last time I checked, the 6bone was an adhock network of folks running
(mostly) v6-in-v4 tunnels between each other to establish v6 (notice I
don't make distinction between 3ffe::/16 and 2001::/16 here) connectivity
in the absence of NATIVE v6 connections.  Granted, there are some native
v6 links.  That is great.  The *majority* of links are v6-in-v4 tunnels
though.

If you're complaining about people running production services on 6bone
PREFIXES, perhaps they haven't gotten around to getting their RIR space
yet.  Perhaps they haven't made the obvious distinction between their v6
and v4 webservers. (Hint: www.[domain].com = v4, www.ipv6.[domain[.com =
v6)  This gives the USER the choice, based on the URL they type in.

I honestly don't see a problem with the two (6bone and production) being
interweaved.  Had the aggregation mistake been made on a 3ffe::/16 prefix,
it wouldn't have been as big of a deal.  The fact that it aggregated the
entire ARIN RIR *production* v6 space was the problem.



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